Cruiser Command

30 damage a second compared to the corvette rushing the Destroyer for approximately 150 damage a second isn't really comparable Dread.

I'm still completely against 'activatable ability to buff the next quantum bombardment.' I still think it's the blandest, most boring way to go about things when you could be giving rewards for particular styles of play.

Also, I'm sorry, 10 second cooldown on a relatively bland firing ability is absolutely stupid. Imagine if you had to wait 10 seconds between each battlecruiser single burst shot. Nobody wants a standardized weapon like that.

Also the 20 projectiles dealing 4 damage each misdirects the player. A standard laser projectile deals roughly 12 damage -- this is fairly universal, with the exception of things like the destroyer main gun and missiles. It seems weird to suddenly decide to go against that standardization for no other purpose than flair. At most, I think 5 would be fine with a lower damage output. 20 shots is clearly overcompensating for something...

WhyteDragon wrote:I'm still completely against 'activatable ability to buff the next quantum bombardment.' I still think it's the blandest, most boring way to go about things when you could be giving rewards for particular styles of play.

I guess growing up with WoW and Lotro is why i like it =P (and because your basically hitting rotations (which takes some skill, especially with the maneuverability of a destroyer) and customizing your next bombardment)

WhyteDragon wrote:30 damage a second compared to the corvette rushing the Destroyer for approximately 150 damage a second isn't really comparable Dread.

Since when do corvettes "sustain" that amount of damage? DPS cant really apply to them because 1) from anywhere away from point-blank striking distance, their projectiles only hit 1-2 at a time (15-30 or so DPS) 2) the cone only fires in front of them, if they run away, no damage, a destroyer however can fire in any direction, not to mention that the cone is roughly 35-40 degrees for 5 projectiles (Siretu plz check) for 5 projectiles, while the destroyer has a supposed cone of 20, for 3 projectiles.

Dreadnought wrote:Also, I'm sorry, 10 second cooldown on a relatively bland firing ability is absolutely stupid. Imagine if you had to wait 10 seconds between each battlecruiser single burst shot. Nobody wants a standardized weapon like that.

Also the 20 projectiles dealing 4 damage each misdirects the player. A standard laser projectile deals roughly 12 damage -- this is fairly universal, with the exception of things like the destroyer main gun and missiles. It seems weird to suddenly decide to go against that standardization for no other purpose than flair. At most, I think 5 would be fine with a lower damage output. 20 shots is clearly overcompensating for something...

No ship in Cruiser Command has 2 main weapons, the Destroyer has a main weapon, the quantum bombardment, why add a second main weapon that doesnt really fit the purpose of the destroyer in the first place? The swat cannon has so many advantages already, it should have a cooldown of 10 seconds, and not distract the destroyers actual role of using quantum bombardment against capital targets. I mean, cmon with that amount of health the destroyer would be viable against ships in a 1v1 fight, thats totally overpowered...as for adding 'Flair' to the weapon, 1) it was just a suggestion, and 2) you said so yourself, the weapon is bland, its basically a cut-down version of the corvettes main weapon with an absurd amount of extra utility, make it more unique =P (whats it compensating for?...blandness?)

Dreadnought wrote:I guess growing up with WoW and Lotro is why i like it =P (and because your basically hitting rotations (which takes some skill, especially with the maneuverability of a destroyer) and customizing your next bombardment)

It's not customizing.
There are no 'options.'
You either have it or don't.
Customizing is the concept being the currently offered Destroyer upgrades -- hull damage or energy damage.

Dreadnought wrote:Since when do corvettes "sustain" that amount of damage? DPS cant really apply to them because 1) from anywhere away from point-blank striking distance, their projectiles only hit 1-2 at a time (15-30 or so DPS) 2) the cone only fires in front of them, if they run away, no damage, a destroyer however can fire in any direction, not to mention that the cone is roughly 35-40 degrees for 5 projectiles (Siretu plz check) for 5 projectiles, while the destroyer has a supposed cone of 20, for 3 projectiles.

Yet you go ahead and assume all 3 destroyer projectiles will hit.
I see no reason why there should be a scenario where 60% of the corvette's projectiles miss while all 3 of the destroyers still hit. You make a lot of one sided assumptions for the sake of the argument.
If we were to assume that ~60% of the destroyer's projectiles missed, it would be dealing 6 DPS. I understand the cone is smaller, but isn't that even more reason to assume the Corvette is just going to go for the 100% projectile trade by point blanking it? I don't get why you'd bother assuming otherwise. It's pretty much what the Corvette excels at too.

Dreadnought wrote:No ship in Cruiser Command has 2 main weapons, the Destroyer has a main weapon, the quantum bombardment, why add a second main weapon that doesnt really fit the purpose of the destroyer in the first place?

It's the destroyer. If you can tell me how it 'does not fit' rather than just saying 'no it doesn't', then I'll be inclined to believe it. I have already put forth several reasons it would be reasonable -- they're mild zoning options. You're giving an ability that's on a two second cooldown way too much credit as if it was some sort of god tier ability.

Dreadnought wrote:The swat cannon has so many advantages already, it should have a cooldown of 10 seconds, and not distract the destroyers actual role of using quantum bombardment against capital targets

I would love the idea of having to manage two weapons on one ship. The wraith is dozens times more fun than most other combat ships because there's a lot of things you can do with it. Engine management, EMP, firing, side thrusters, cloaking... Especially since the Quantum Bombardment is pretty simple to use in reality. Click a toggle and point.

Only slightly harder than pointing and clicking repeatedly.

Dreadnought wrote:I mean, cmon with that amount of health the destroyer would be viable against ships in a 1v1 fight, thats totally overpowered...

Seriously? Did... did you really..? Just... just read that out loud to yourself.
It's. A destroyer. The most expensive ship in the game.
God FORBID it potentially contest the cheapest ships in the game in one on one combat. Such blasphemy -- this is not what we grew up with! No, it should inflexibly remain completely vulnerable with absolutely no defense mechanisms whatsoever! That is what our grandfathers have taught us!
... I'll leave you to stew on your choice of words.

Dreadnought wrote:as for adding 'Flair' to the weapon, 1) it was just a suggestion, and 2) you said so yourself, the weapon is bland, its basically a cut-down version of the corvettes main weapon with an absurd amount of extra utility, make it more unique =P (whats it compensating for?...blandness?)

I said relatively bland. As a firing mechanism, it's definitely more interesting than most of the small ship weapons.

It's a 'core ability' that creates definition. It doesn't need excessive flair. The ability is bland but what it does for the ship is incredibly useful because it was tailored in such a way that it acts as a minor deterrent. Moreover the usage of excessive projectiles in a small cone ends up just overlapping for the most part pointlessly, doing nothing more than causing extra unnecessary strain on the game.

Not everything needs to be dressed up like a psychedelic clown. Having a few core mechanics that are simple and straightforward are necessary -- look at the wraith gun, single burst, ETC.
Comparatively, adding an extra unique damage upgrade on top of the already existing one for a ship is silly. Tiered upgrades get away with it because it comes in a 'box package.'

After a most mighty Skype battle filled with explosives...

Ill just say that nevermind, a simple 2 to 10 second cooldown adjustment is not needed, it should be something never introduced to the destroyer.

Also, the value of the destroyer is in its ability to fight battlecruisers, unlike other ships it is designed to fight a battlecruiser. Not in a 1v1 context, but greatly support allied battlecruisers more effectively then any other ship (except potentially the subjugator, which has its own rules)

Dreadnought wrote:After a most mighty Skype battle filled with explosives...

Ill just say that nevermind, a simple 2 to 10 second cooldown adjustment is not needed, it should be something never introduced to the destroyer.

Not sure if that means the cooldown adjustment should not be introduced or that the swat cannon should not be added at all.

Okay, so I've been avoiding this thread for some time.

My opinion is: I think having the Destroyer being effective against small ships is bad. Even though it's an expensive and powerful ship, it shouldn't do everything. That said, I don't think giving the Destroyer some ability to fight back against small ships is a bad thing, as long as it is not too powerful. The swat cannon should not be powerful enough to make attacking Destroyer's a bad idea. It just means an experienced destroyer pilot can probably kill less experienced corvettes while having trouble with good wraiths and corvettes, because destroyer's shouldn't counter all ships.

I also agree with Whyte that controlling two weapons is not a bad thing, and we've previously (years ago) discussed an omni-directional weapon on the destroyer. Having more stuff to constantly do is fun, and part of what raises the skill level of Wraiths.

So in the end...the augmentations are better

I doubt we can get ANY sort of change to the destroyer with this level of argument. For you guys there is no room to improve someone's suggestion, its either yes or no, and in the end, nothing changes because we cant agree or even improve on anyones idea.

Same goes for the subjugator.