Wishlist:

Any suggestions or ideas regarding cruiser command
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slapshot
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Wishlist:

Post by slapshot »

1. Ai position of "damage control" where they patrol the ship and use fixpacks where needed on debris (or when hull is low on HP), maybe as a secondary role to something like refine/load missles (or maybe combine the 3 into 1 AI role and let the AI console set a priority on each task.. say always repair the hull, then refine, then load missiles)

2. kinetic weapon improvement - so that it keeps using kinetic until toggled off, rather then getting a couple of shots, and then requiring 5 seconds to switch from laser back to kinetic - having a 5 second cooldown if needed for balance issues is fine (although it is underpowered..), but it shouldn't switch back to lasers

3. option of forcing AI miners to use mining boost only if they have 400 energy (so that they always have a turbo-jump before they use the boost)

4. a SS "ram" upgrade that reduces collision damage from the front on say.. miners and chompers

5. moar kerm to spawn (but like the moving asteroids, not the timed kerm spawns)

6. a BC mining laser upgrade (or perhaps mine asteroids with tractor beam.. as it seems to be under-utilized)

7. an option for miner bots to auto-buy a miner if enough resources are available and they are sitting in the hanger doing nothing (waiting for an available miner)

8. the ability to build/repair defense turrets (against infiltration), and perhaps even some sort of detection turret (to counter nullifier)

9. moar upgrades - certain upgrades are maxed quite fast.. (weapons especially)

10. more hanger slots, or perhaps a sort of stardock which allows ships to dock/repair (maybe even attack, but be stationary)

11. team-colored fire - AI's seem to be able to detect if a projectile is friendly or not, even if they both are the same shade of green wraith fire.. (star wars for example has red/green lasers..)

12. option for a team of 100% AI's to play (not well, but atleast miner/refine/shoot lasers..) - basically what they already do, but have the AI controls console be auto-set at the start, maybe even have an AI on nav to head to kerm and run away when needed.. and another on upgrades that just does a list of pre-defined upgrades in order... (for better solo practice, as the game has a steep learning curve...)

13. Protoss/zerg races, with their own miners, attack/defense ships, upgrades, etc. (hey it's a wishlist!)

#14 - a raven ship which can detect infiltrators, place auto-turrets (roughly as powerful as a wraith, but stationary), give energy to allies, and EMP enemy ships (even the BC - make it do some shield damage!) - this ship should cost quite a bit of kerm, but no red

15. - space the items from construction into different areas (so repair kits and missiles don't get mixed up)
Last edited by slapshot on Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:04 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Siretu
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Re: Wishlist:

Post by Siretu »

(Going to move this into suggestions since there's no real reason to hide it from everyone else)

1. Yes, I want this. I just haven't figured out a good algorithm for placing repair stations.

2. Not sure about changing the toggle mechanic but I'm all for buffing it.

3. This is already the case. It wont use accelerate mining beam unless there's two or more asteroids and it has over 400 energy.

4. Possible, but I'm not sure I like it.

5. I feel like the current level of kerm is good. If you over saturate the map with kerm, the spawning kerm becomes less necessary and the metagame will evolve into both BCs staying still for 30 minutes until they're maxed on upgrades.

6. This feature would take some time to implement and I'm not sure of it's period of use. Early/mid game, the captain is occupied with a lot of other stuff and everyone else are needed elsewhere. Why would you have a person stay back on the BC just to sit and mine in an immobile object. Later on in the game, it could be slightly useful but not often. It'll probably be better to just have the person launch a miner instead.

7. Hmm, I could add this, sure. The only problem is that I would have to add support for letting ships be bought with triggers which shouldn't be too hard.

8. Problem with building is that it has to be limited to specific places to prevent blocking off passages and stuff which could be used for trolling or completely blocking infiltration. Repairing is okay but I'm not sure about countering infiltration, it would have to be done right.

9. See the new thread in the CC discussion forum about upgrades. I would rather reshape the current upgrades to be more interesting before I start adding random upgrades.

10. It was just increased by 2 recently. A stardock is a possibility but it would take time to implement and could be OP.

11. The problem with this is that it limits the amount of colors I can use for the projectiles which also means you have to remember double the amount of colors to identify a ship firing in the distance.

12. I really want this, but it's easier said than done. I am working towards it by adding more and more roles to the AI. However, even if you automatically sat the roles at start, it still wouldn't be able to play properly. When I get some more AIs in (Navigation, power and upgrades), I can work on a overhead AI that changes the tasks dynamically to distribute AIs between different tasks.

13. Would love to do that but it's a LOT to implement and we cant do it because there's no place for a protoss or zerg ship design.
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Re: Wishlist:

Post by zakhennahr »

For #1: An adequate algorithm for placing repair stations would be to order all debris in terms of how close they are to consoles and give them a ranking. For example, debris on the power would have a *much* higher priority for repair than debris next to the docking bays. Then check in that order for each piece of debris if the AI holding repair stations can reach it. If so, then place one repair station next to it, and move on to the next piece of debris. If not, then just skip this pile of debris.

A much more advanced algorithm would be *fanfare*:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K-means_clustering

Where K = 6, the max amount of repair stations you can carry, or, alternatively, something like 12 clusters with the priority system above.
Then the AI can try to place the repair stations where the average position of each cluster of debris falls.

For #4: I like it. It'll basically be like wearing ship armor. You can wear fire armor inside the ship, or nanodoc gloves, and so on. Why not have different types of hull plating to place on your ship? Sure, you can place the "Extra HP Hull Plating", where the hull upgrades give you the full bonus, or you could take out the "Impact-Resistant Hull Plating" after you buy it (per ship), where you only get half the HP bonus but ramming does 50% less damage to you, great for those who expect to be smacked by asteroids or other crazy pilots, but not as useful against tanking actual shots.

For #11: It may be adequate to give each team's projectiles an aftereffect of sorts. Blue team's wraith will shoot green projectiles with slightly blue tails, and red team's wraith will shoot green projectiles with slightly red tails.
Last edited by zakhennahr on Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Siretu
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Re: Wishlist:

Post by Siretu »

Hah, I actually know how to do K-means clustering. Awesome. I would like an algorithm that fills the bottom floor with repair stations optimally.
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Re: Wishlist:

Post by zakhennahr »

Crap, I was hoping my stealth edit would appear before anyone read the original! I added my thoughts to two more of the points. And the hard part about what you are saying is, how do you define 'optimally'? Once that question is answered it should be easy to come up or re-implement any algorithm.
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slapshot
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Re: Wishlist:

Post by slapshot »

#1 - even if all they do is use a repair kit @ the nearest debris that isn't currently being repaired, that's enough - optimizing/prioritizing it can be added in later (and besides that, if someone needs power to be repaired, that means a human wants to use power, and therefore they should be better than the bot at repairing anyways..)

#2 - I used kinetics for the first time recently and I thought it was broke or something (until it was explained to me after the game) - I kept using it and it kept switching back to laser and I was like WTF and gave up on it...

#3 - good to know.. (I could of sworn I saw it not do that, but maybe it had its energy drained or something..)

#4 - I thought it would be interesting to limit crash damage to the front of the ship in particular.. like having a plow basically (and I was thinking upgrade, not armor item), since it wouldn't make sense on a ship like the wraith which has a weapon in front already

#8 - there are unbuildable terrain types (or you could build some sort of path blocker..)

#10 - I am thinking something that would initially be without weapons, and not much shields/hp - just enough to dock at to repair the ship (or maybe not even "dock", but heal nearby friendly ships)

#12 - yes it wouldn't be anywhere close to playing yet (I didn't even mention power management..), but for example if you had miners out, you could practice wraithing against bots, and also avoiding the BC shots by bots, which is probably a lot more exciting for new players than mining if they ever decide to do a single player run to practice, and a simple NAV where it moves near kerm if/when it spawns, and runs away from the enemy BC if/when it sees it would be still be a huge improvement

#13 - I wasn't expecting too much out of this one

#14 - a raven ship which can detect infiltrators, place auto-turrets (roughly as powerful as a wraith, but stationary), give energy to allies, and EMP enemy ships (even the BC - make it do some shield damage!) - this ship should cost quite a bit of kerm, but no red
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Re: Wishlist:

Post by zakhennahr »

I agree with #1 being solved greedily by placing a repair station next to the closest pile of debris, if possible. This should be super easy to implement. However, there's never going to be an easy way to always find the minimum amount of repair stations required to repair all the debris, so Siretu can only do so much optimizing.
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slapshot
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Re: Wishlist:

Post by slapshot »

bump/update - I still want the raven ship

15. I would also like to suggest having repair kits /ship items/missiles spawn in a slightly different area, such that they don't all clump together in a big mess

16. an option of getting AI's with miners to come dock and take a shield, and then head back out - there are way to many manual steps required to do this currently
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Re: Wishlist:

Post by Red-Rocket »

1) agreed
2) It already works, you can still fire even when changing weps
3) agreed
4) dont think so, probably with corvettes it would be more fun
5) definitely agreed
6) It worked in WC3, im not sure it will work out well with SC2 but im open to it
7) definitely agreed
8) im against having more turrets, i think that there are to many turrets and the only way to board a ship is with nullifier and nanodic gloves just to get anywhere. Although we could make it purchasable like in WC3
9) more upgrades, but be careful about it, dont want miners with 16 hull upgrades early on... got to find a limit during time or other upgrades thing
10) dont need it, in my opinion
11) na, the less you know the more fun...where those our destroyer shots headed towards us?
12) Siretu Dreams of this
13) WE ALL WANT IT! but it will be hard, and lack sufficient space unless Siretu goes smaller with the BC layouts
14) fun!
15) agreed, i gues...

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Re: Wishlist:

Post by WhyteDragon »

For #8, I think the easier way of going about it (if at all) would be to make it such that whenever a turret is destroyed it leaves behind a type of 'turret debris' that could be fixed by some sort of object, maybe just repair kits. That way you don't have to worry so much about turrets being created in wall like formations ETC, just as Siretu said.

Here's the kicker that I would see out of this, however. What if the infiltrator could also repair those broken turrets? Typically it won't change much if they're being expected, but if an infiltrator truly manages to sneak in without being detected, or is simply unable to be contested when he enters, it gives him the possibility to set up his own line of defense rather than being charged by 3 people simultaneously and unable to do much. Because of how turrets work, it would also grant the infiltrator a bit of sight upon the enemy ship.

Obviously something like this could also end up being a huge issue if the infiltrator is good enough to take over the entire ship, or cut people off from the construction console entirely and make it such that they can't buy weapons anymore, so it's something to consider with caution. But I would also point out that simply going around shooting turrets and repairing them all day takes a lot of time to set up as well, and is fairly easily for a large team to rectify if done wrong. Just an idea that came to mind ultimately.
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